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more [cam-shit]
Okay, even accepting that a bloodline founder must be a PC (something I still don't believe is 100% necessary, as I would rather promote the idea of such rather then require it), why must the PC be alive at the start of the chronicle?
Let's face it... out of the five bloodlines presented in the Requiem book, at least one of them (Malkovians) has already had their founder geeked, and it's within the realm of possibility that the Bruja founder is already a kipper on a cracker as well.
And yet... and yet, it is, for some reason, seen as less then desireable for a PC bloodline founder to have died in the backstory.
So let me ask this... is it any less "good" for the game if, mere moments upon entering their first game, a bloodline founder walks into a wandering gank-squad, becoming the latest victim of their combat cheese?
When is it acceptable for the bloodline founder to die? A week after entering game? A month? Is it somehow better that they die in play, no matter how they die, rather then actually having a backstory death?
I don't think so.
Sure, it's preferrable to have a founder come into play, last as long as the player has a story to tell, etc. and so forth. But that doesn't always happen. And yet, the tone I'm getting from some people is that it's preferrable (in the extreme case) for a PC founder to last minutes or hours rather then having been dead for a couple of decades.
This makes no sense to me.
Further, I despise the belief that having a bloodline founder "start" dead is somehow cheesy or ruining the game for others, or that "letting" people get around the cost of one of them making the founder themselves by having the founder start off the chronicle dead is likewise cheesy or ruining the game for others.
Personally, I hold it's the people who are that hyper-concerned about others "ruining" the game every time someone spots a flaw in the rules logic who are the real people who are doing more harm then good to the game.
But that's just my opinion, I'm just a bastard.
(And yes,![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
bauglier, you can copy this over to your journal if you want.)
Let's face it... out of the five bloodlines presented in the Requiem book, at least one of them (Malkovians) has already had their founder geeked, and it's within the realm of possibility that the Bruja founder is already a kipper on a cracker as well.
And yet... and yet, it is, for some reason, seen as less then desireable for a PC bloodline founder to have died in the backstory.
So let me ask this... is it any less "good" for the game if, mere moments upon entering their first game, a bloodline founder walks into a wandering gank-squad, becoming the latest victim of their combat cheese?
When is it acceptable for the bloodline founder to die? A week after entering game? A month? Is it somehow better that they die in play, no matter how they die, rather then actually having a backstory death?
I don't think so.
Sure, it's preferrable to have a founder come into play, last as long as the player has a story to tell, etc. and so forth. But that doesn't always happen. And yet, the tone I'm getting from some people is that it's preferrable (in the extreme case) for a PC founder to last minutes or hours rather then having been dead for a couple of decades.
This makes no sense to me.
Further, I despise the belief that having a bloodline founder "start" dead is somehow cheesy or ruining the game for others, or that "letting" people get around the cost of one of them making the founder themselves by having the founder start off the chronicle dead is likewise cheesy or ruining the game for others.
Personally, I hold it's the people who are that hyper-concerned about others "ruining" the game every time someone spots a flaw in the rules logic who are the real people who are doing more harm then good to the game.
But that's just my opinion, I'm just a bastard.
(And yes,
bauglier, you can copy this over to your journal if you want.)
If it ever posts to Cam-Rules
Here is the text of the message in case it gets lost in the ethers:
Yes that is correct, the philosophy of player created bloodlines is that the Founders are PC's and thus they would be active in the game. It is not a contradiction of "canon", since this was what having the rules for PC created bloodlines was intended for.
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This is an extended explanation based on further conversations with the Developer.
In White Wolf's game design there are two different types of Bloodlines.
The first being those Bloodlines published and fleshed out by White Wolf for use by Storytellers. These are considered "General" Bloodlines, they have been designed so that the Founders are not active which allows the Storyteller a "metaplot" free slate to work with. These bloodlines give players who wish to play them enough generalized material to create a character and run with it. If the Storyteller wishes to throw in more background material they can, and most certainly will.
The second type of bloodline is the Player Character created bloodline. These are "Specialized" bloodlines that are created by players normally through the course of an ongoing chronicle. These Specialized bloodlines have Player Character Founders who would be active either as the Player themselves or part of the extended background. This allows the Players to create more personal story based around the bloodline. The offset to this of course was the institution of the mechanic requirements to form a bloodline.
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Below is my opinion:
Where the Camarilla mucks this up of course is the fact that we have pretty much shot the hell out of the worldview that most Vampires are young and have low Blood Potency. The MC system allows players to start with the ability to create bloodlines at character creation rather than incept them during the course of game-play.
But then again if we did not have the ability to have PC's come into play at Blood Potency 6 and thus be able to start as PC Founders then in all probability this issue would not have come up, as we would not have players entering the field of bloodline creation until they reached 6 and then the story of that creation would happen in-game as it was envisioned not in background as it is currently being done.
The base White Wolf philosophy that Player Created bloodlines should be created by players, is still around with the addenda statement that Founders be players who meet the Blood Potency requirements, which was the only base requirement listed in Requiem. The additional description of bloodline creation of having to Master the bloodline 4th discipline however is not being enforced which is a deviation from printed source, but does allow player created bloodlines to come into play at the inception of the chronicle.
----------------
Charles Bailey
Camarilla Club Director
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AIM - charleseb9
ICQ - 17937548
Yahoo - wwolfar
MSN - charlesb@white-wolf.com
Malkov and Bruja
The philosophy of being vague in the published bloodlines was to allow the Storyteller to create their own version of what is going on in the current nights. In the case of the Camarilla that Storyteller would be Alex and he may well have plans for those NPC's that does not include them being dead.
Remember White Wolf in general is not presenting the "metaplot" material in the books and IC suggested systems that are published have no impact above the city level.